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  Toonami Infolink :: View topic - Technophobia: Is Science Really Worth It?
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Technophobia: Is Science Really Worth It?
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JohnnyPsycho

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Post subject: Technophobia: Is Science Really Worth It?
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I recently wrote a critical paper upon the genre of science fiction, and while I don't want to retype the whole damn thing in here, I do want to make notice of a few arguments I came upon while writing this essay. For those of you who want to save time (and possibly risk saying something I already said here), I have courteously put the question (and thereby the reason of this thread) in BOLD at the bottom.

Science and technological discovery is fastly becoming the new logic of our society, and is replacing the old forms of logic (religion, magic, "old fashioned family values") at a rate that alarms many fundamentalists in these old forms. The most successful and popular of science-fiction themes have been the "man vs. machine" themes. Movies such as Jurassic Park, the Terminator films, The Matrix, Metropolis, and even pre-film stories like Frankenstein have pitted man versus some sort of technological and scientific creation/discovery. Jurassic Park questioned the ethics of genetics; The Matrix questions the proliferation of computer technology in our society and its possible effects upon it. Perhaps it is because these "old forms of logic" are still present that science and technology is examined so sternly.

However, I decided to relate these themes of "man vs. machine" to the story of the Sorcerer's Apprentice, one that has become famously envisioned in modern imagination by Walt Disney's Fantasia. However, this story is much older than Mickey Mouse, and it is in essence the story of scientific power itself. I'll illustrate:

There is a sorcerer, wise in the ways of using magic (his Craft), and his apprentice who wishes to learn how to use the Craft.

While the master is away, the apprentice decides to use the Craft to his own devices, envisioning ways in which to use the Craft. He animates the now classic broomstick, and for a while the apprentice's knowledge of the Craft is enough for him to succeed in his goal.

However, once the goal is attained, the broomstick does not stop, and the apprentice finds himself unable to control the Craft any longer. The Craft now becomes the Threat, and the Threat endangers the apprentice.

In the end of most versions of the tale, the sorcerer (the source and master of the Craft) is able to use his greater skill and experience to undo the damage done by the apprentice.

Science has become the new Craft, replacing magic and religious mysticism. Science also has the ablility to become a new Threat.

In most "man vs. machine" stories, there is a person or group of people who are inexperienced in the use or knowledge of the Craft (think Sarah Connor from the Terminator films, or maybe Neo in The Matrix), a person or group of people with greater experience or knowledge of both Craft and Threat (Kyle Reese from the first Terminator or John Connor from both; Morpheus and the other humans that exist outside of "The Matrix"), and the Threat born of the Craft (the T-101 and T-1000 cyborgs, as well as the Skynet computer created by Cyberdyne that causes the future Holocaust in the first place; the Matrix itself and the individual components that make up the Matrix, such as the Agents). In most of these stories, the apprentice (and sometimes the sorcerer) is pursued by the Threat because of their inablility to cope with the power represented by the Threat.

These stories are built upon an underlying anxiety in our society about technology. Science and technology not only supply humans with power and the tools by which to actively control our environment, but it also mirrors how powerless we are. Technology is the testament of human imagination and ingenuity. Technology is also more powerful than human bodies; the limits of humanity make us feel frail and inadequate in comparison to the idealized, "perfect" creations of technology.

Normally, "man vs. machine" stories end in one of two ways: Man wins over machine, with his own knowledge of the Craft of technology at his side, being the master of it and in some way superior to it; or man loses to machine, his own hubris being his undoing, overpowered by his own creation and only able to realize his foolishness too late.

Here is the question: Which take do you personally think is most realistic? Is the progress of science getting too overpowering for humanity to control? Are stories of "tampering with powers beyond our control" simply a case of slight technophobia or a warning of the harmful effects unchecked scientific discovery may have on us?
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PostMon Nov 25, 2002 4:17 pm
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counterparadox

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Eventually some crackpot will make self-evolving nanobots. Then, we're screwed. Oh, yeah, and this is only about 50 years away, tops.

But like I said in the evolution thread, I'm off my game recently, and so that's all I have to say for now.
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PostMon Nov 25, 2002 7:20 pm
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Zechs

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Screw self-evolving nano bots. Any kind of nanobot could be mean a quick death or the human race. If one idiot gets ahold of the technology and developes ones that can attack the human nevous sytem or once ingested can destroy vital organs there is no medical treatment to kill a nonorganic disease.

Technophobia isn't just a bunch of frightened fundamentalists it's anyone who knows how far technology has progressed and how far it could go in just our lifetime. There is no question with the availability of high tech today that someone or something will eventually take advantage of it. It's only a matter of time before it happens.
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 8:09 pm
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Spookmonkey

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what will happen is we will hit a plataeu with computers eventually allowing us to catch up to the advancments and what they actually mean. It's happened before with other wild progress booms and so it will happen again. The question is: How will it be until it happens?
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 8:22 pm
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Zechs

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Well every year proccesors get closer and closer to hitting The Wall which will mean the end of chip advancement for a while to come until we make a breakthrough with one of the expermental computing technologies that we've been working on for the past decade like DNA or Quantum computers which are still LONG way from being made into anything marketable.
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 8:29 pm
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Spookmonkey

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it's really only been in the last few years that computer technology has really taken off. I give it to 2010 before computers begin the plataeu. We're in the middle of the next revolution. We all know it. It was the industrial revolution last time and it's computers this time. there will be a time when it all slows down and we get to catch up. Wow, talk about deja vu, I swear I said this all before. Important Breakthroughs happen pretty much every 50 years (even in they are just semi-important), so it realyl won't be until 2050ish before we see another huge leap in a short time with anything I think.
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 8:51 pm
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counterparadox

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I disagree, Spook. In today's world, there are more people, faster means of communication, more access to resources of all sorts. I think the gap between revolutions will close significantly. Very significantly. The world is different now, way different. It's as if this revolution will make more revolutions possible. We can either ride it to glory, or be typical humans and mess everything up and kill ourselves.
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 9:09 pm
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Force-Attuned_Krogoth

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Hey, everybody remember Space: Above & Beyond? Take a chance!

Basically, we're fine as long as programmers/inventors are careful about what they're doing. However, there are a lot of things we create that we only control because they have an "off" switch. If we take it away, we run the risk of getting screwed.

Because of this inherent frailty, I predict that such disasters will inevitably occur. Hopefully, they won't happen until we spread beyond our ability to easily influence each other. Once quick communication/transportation is gone, the Threat becomes much easier to handle. Just quarantine the affected area, learn from their mistake (if possible) and continue on with the rest of humanity. Just remember to always include an off switch or quarantine possibilities.
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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 10:31 pm
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Spookmonkey

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I really don['t think so, I think we will just go a bit further on each revolution than the last, I don't think major changes in lifestyle will happen to different from the past. Life 100 years ago was far FAR different form life 50 years ago and life 50 years ago was far different than it is now. Basicly we as humans use 50 to expand our technological horizens then use the next 50 to explore what we can do with the new space. It's always been that way. The only reason why think it's different is because you are living in the now. Do you remember all of the atomic energy sci-fi horror movies of the 50's? Aparently not, they thought the same thing about Atomic Energy as we do about computers. There is a chance for it to go out of control, we make the movies to show worst case scenarios basicly to safeguard ourselves from that happening.
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I came. I saw. I spooked.

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PostTue Nov 26, 2002 11:01 pm
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Force-Attuned_Krogoth

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True . . . I forgot about the inherent safety valves. They'll prevent most people from doing crazy stupid shit. However, our fast movement/communication systems could easily become a liability in a crisis.

Aah, crap. I've done waaay too much thinking today. My brain hurts, and I need to stop. I've lost my ability to say useful things. Need . . . games . . .
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"Wait, that's not the cure button ... "
PostTue Nov 26, 2002 11:13 pm
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John_Bono_Smithy_Satchmo

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"Well, hey, Dick!"
"Well hey, George!"
"Say, what does this button do?"
"I don't know, why don't you press it?"
"I think I will."
And thus humanity is ended--the individual parts can't be knowledged enough to understand the sum of the machine.
Humanity, or at least parts of it, are doomed (let's just hope we can separate the doomed quickly enough).
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PostWed Nov 27, 2002 12:05 am
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counterparadox

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What I'm saying is that with this new boom in tech, we have communication amped up to places unknown. With said tech, we can convey ideas and new inventions and resources so quickly, the gap between revolutions will decrease. There is a percentage of humans that likes to think and create and discover (like a good percent of the people on this board (to be more swpecific, all of the people that actively participate in these threads)) and I know that I"M not gonna sit idly by and not create stuff.

I'm not saying the computer revolution will go on forever, sure we'll plataeu. But the newt revolution won't be far behind.
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PostWed Nov 27, 2002 11:13 am
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dougisfunny

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http://homework.genesee.suny.edu/~stclairdr/gradient.swf
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The problem with America is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
PostWed Nov 27, 2002 12:16 pm
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JohnnyPsycho

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*sniffs back a tear at seeing all the lovely discussion going on here*

I'm so damn proud of you boys... *sniff*
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"The principles you live by create the world you live in; if you change the principles you live by, you will change your world." -Blaine Lee

"I plan to live forever. So far so good." -Steven Wright
PostWed Nov 27, 2002 12:49 pm
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dougisfunny

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screw man vs machine(craft)... someone with a nuke is gonna go nutto and blow up the earth
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The problem with America is stupidity. I'm not saying there should be a capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
PostWed Nov 27, 2002 1:11 pm
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